Today’s debate is a fun-filled face-off between two timeless playground favorites. It’s Tag vs. Hide and Seek! Story Pirate, improviser and motion capture actor Nick Kanellis will demonstrate speed and agility for Team Tag while Story Pirate Peter McNerney will use stealth and strategy for Team Hide and Seek. Who will be crowned the Smash Boom Best? Vote below for the team YOU think won!
Also… do you have your Smarty Pass yet? Get yours today for just $5/month (or $45/year) and get bonus episodes every month, and ad-free versions of every episode of Brains On, Smash Boom Best, Moment of Um and Forever Ago. Visit www.smartypass.org to get your Smarty Pass today. As an added bonus, your Smarty Pass will grant you access to a super special debate starring Sanden and Molly!
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NARRATOR: From the brains behind Brains On!, it's Smash Boom Best, the show for people with big opinions.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
MOLLY BLOOM: Hi, I'm Molly Bloom and this is Smash Boom Best, the show where we take two things, smash them together, and ask you to decide which one is best. Today's debate is a fun filled face off between two timeless playground favorites. It's tag versus hide and seek. Story Pirate improviser and motion capture actor Nick Canales is here to demonstrate speed and agility for team tag.
NICK CANALES: No need to brag. It's the game that doesn't drag. It's more fun to play tag. Let's hear it for the tag team champions of the world!
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] And Story Pirate Peter McNerney is here with a heavy dose of stealth and strategy for team hide and seek.
PETER MCNERNEY: Your long search has ended, for you have found the greatest game in human history. It is hide and seek!
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] And here to judge it all is Truman from Stillwater, Minnesota. Truman is currently starring in his first professional musical, enjoys Dungeons and Dragons, and would one day love to be a Broadway actor who moonlights as a professional therapist. Hi, Truman.
TRUMAN: Hi!
MOLLY BLOOM: So, what is it like to be in a professional musical?
TRUMAN: It's so much fun. It's so cool being surrounded by the people you want to grow up to be.
MOLLY BLOOM: That sounds very, very cool. And what draws you in about being a therapist someday?
TRUMAN: My mom's a therapist, and I think it's just a really cool job because you get to help people. And I've always been intrigued about mental health. And I just think it's super interesting.
MOLLY BLOOM: That's great. And you've judged Smash Boom Best multiple times now.
TRUMAN: Yeah.
MOLLY BLOOM: Do you have any advice for our debaters today?
TRUMAN: Make me laugh and references.
MOLLY BLOOM: Hm, references and laughs. Will Truman side with Nick or Peter? Only time will tell. But first, here are the rules. Every debate consists of four rounds, the Declaration of Greatness, the Micro Round, the Sneak Attack, and the Final Six. After each round, our judge, Truman, will award points to the team that impresses him the most but he'll keep his decisions top secret until the end of the debate.
Listeners, we want you to judge too. Mark down your points as you listen. At the end of the show, head to our website, smashboom.org, and vote for whichever team you think won. OK, Nick, Peter, and Truman, are you ready?
TRUMAN: Yeah!
PETER MCNERNEY: Born ready.
NICK CANALES: Take the letter E, color it red.
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] Then, it's time for the--
NARRATOR: Declaration of Greatness.
MOLLY BLOOM: In this round, our debaters will present a well crafted, immersive argument in favor of their side. Then, they'll each have 30 seconds to rebut their opponent's statements. We flipped a coin and Nick, you're up first. Tell us what is so terrific about tag.
NICK CANALES: I love tag, it's easily my favorite game, but lately, I'm getting tagged way too often. So I decided to join my local gym to get in shape and up my game.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
By the way, did I mention this is a tag gym?
BRYCE CLINE: Yo! What's up, tag maniacs! My name is Bryce Cline, owner of The Fountain, a.k.a. the best tag gym Des Moines has to offer. Let me show you around. Over here, we've got slopes, rails, and a wicked jumping wall. Everything you need to practice death defying escapes from an epic tagger. Isn't that right, Lexi?
SUBJECT 1: For sure, Bryce.
BRYCE CLINE: Lexi is one of our best clients.
SUBJECT 1: Before I joined The Fountain, I played like an amateur, chasing taggers like a puppy chasing her tail. But now, I'm no puppy. I'm top dog. I used to be it. But now, I'm killing it, running it, flexing it, owning it. Ugh!
BRYCE CLINE: We're so happy you came by to check out the place, Nick. Sign up today and the first month's free. And if you catch me, the second month's free. But you won't!
NICK CANALES: Wow! I can't wait to up my tag game. In case you've been living under a rock, which is sadly a winning hide and seek strategy, tag is a worldwide phenomenon that people have been playing for centuries. Besides being super fun, tag is really good for you. It gets your heart pumping, it requires speed, quick reflexes, and helps you master the art of watching several targets at once. And humans aren't the only ones who love playing tag. Scientists have noticed that young gorillas also play a version of this classic game. Tag is so beloved it's even played by other species.
SUBJECT 2: Hey, Jill, do you want to play tag like a silverback gorilla? Or would you rather play hide and seek like that turtle?
SUBJECT 3: Tag! Tag! I love gorillas!
NICK CANALES: Not only is the game fun, but there are a ton of different ways to play tag, like freeze tag where you get tagged and stay still until someone unfreezes you, or TV tag where you can avoid getting tagged if you say the name of a TV show. Or my favorite, Smash Boom Best tag. It's just like TV tag, but you share a fact about Molly.
SUBJECT 4: Tag, you're it.
SUBJECT 5: Oh wait, Molly Bloom has a phobia of birds named Kevin.
SUBJECT 4: Oh man, you're right.
NICK CANALES: There's also octopus tag, hot dog tag, blob tag, Star Wars tag, and more. And if you get really good, you can play tag professionally.
[TRUMPET SOUND EFFECT]
World chase tag is a competitive sport where two teams race to tag each other in an arena filled with obstacles. It's played internationally and has killer rounds like chase off's and sudden death chase offs. That's for players who are really good at tag. You want to know what happens if you get good at hide and seek? You go missing.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Hide and seek requires a lot of space, dark and musty, old places to hide. But you can play tag anywhere with anyone. You could even play on the moon.
SUBJECT 6: That's one small step for man, one giant leap for mankind.
SUBJECT 7: Tag, you're it, Neil!
SUBJECT 6: Ah! You rascal! Get over here!
SUBJECT 7: Uh, Houston, we have a problem. Neil is never going to catch me.
NICK CANALES: Whether you're playing in a gym, a playground, or outer space, any place is a perfect space for our game of chase, tag. Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to catch Bryce because you know I'm not going to pay full price for that gym membership.
BRYCE CLINE: You're never going to catch me, dude!
NICK CANALES: Yes, I am! [LAUGHS] Come here, Bryce! He's really good at this. He's fast.
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] You just had to mention Kevin, my phobia of birds named Kevin. I don't know if I can go on in this taping. Oh, Nick, what an excellent job. Truman, what stood out to you about Nick's Declaration of Greatness?
TRUMAN: I liked the switch of scenes. It was like the perfect amount of each scene where I could see it in my head. I loved it. The wording was great, and tag is a go to.
MOLLY BLOOM: Mhm, it's true. Peter, it is time for your rebuttal. Tell us why tag is just a red flag. You've got 30 seconds, and your time starts now.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tag? Tag? Really? That's a fun game. You know what I call tag? I call it running around. Ooh! The strategy. Oh, guess what? I'm faster than you. You're it. Game's over. Yeah, that gym thing was very apt because who wants to go to the gym? That's what tag is. Exercise, just exercise. I need to be distracted in my exercise and tag does not do the job. Tag, no one's it!
MOLLY BLOOM: And time. [LAUGHS]
NICK CANALES: I don't really understand why Peter doesn't like to exercise. I think exercising is fun, and I think tag is the perfect way to trick yourself into exercising.
MOLLY BLOOM: OK, it is your turn, Peter. Tell us why hide and seek is so unique.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
PETER MCNERNEY: [LAUGHING] Oh, hi, everyone. Sorry to whisper but I'm in the middle of playing the greatest game of all time, hide and seek. And well, things may have gotten a little out of hand.
SUBJECT 8: Peter, where are you? You've been hiding for four days!
PETER MCNERNEY: [LAUGHS] That's my friend Gary. We're very competitive. Neither one of us has slept since the game began. [LAUGHS] [SNORES] Ah!
SUBJECT 8: Ah! What was that? You're clearly right here in this cookie jar! Ha!
PETER MCNERNEY: [LAUGHS]
SUBJECT 8: What? You're not in here. This jar is full of delicious cookies in the, shape of your face? Did you make these just to mock me?
PETER MCNERNEY: I did.
SUBJECT 8: You'll never defeat me, Peter. I'll find you!
PETER MCNERNEY: Wow, this game rules! But why? Why is the simple act of hiding or seeking so fun? To answer that question, here's me, recorded earlier, when I wasn't hiding in an incredibly cramped spot Peter.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Thanks, Peter. Hi, everyone. Now, you're probably wondering, what am I doing in this idyllic forest untouched by civilization. Is it to set the scene for what life was like for our paleolithic hunter gatherer ancestors? Wow, good guess. It is! You see, we as humans are hardwired to search for stuff, to seek for animals, for plants to eat, for shelter, for water, or any other thing that you might file under need to live. If your great, great, greatest of great grandparents didn't have treasure hunting brains, you probably wouldn't be here.
SUBJECT 9: Hey, Gurks, are you coming? Time to hunt saber toothed tiger.
SUBJECT 10: Oh, shoot. That's today?
SUBJECT 9: Yeah, what? You have something else to do?
SUBJECT 10: Uh, I thought maybe I'd just relax and do some Minecraft.
SUBJECT 9: You mean dig for stones and minerals?
SUBJECT 10: Yeah, what else would I mean?
SUBJECT 9: I don't know. Well, good luck not eating. Bye!
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): So the urge to hide and seek is likely what helped humans survive and thrive.
PETER MCNERNEY: Whoa, so you're saying it's not just for fun, it's important?
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Yes, I am, inexplicable other Peter.
PETER MCNERNEY: This is so cool.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): I know, that's why even to this day, we love to play hide and seek. And to prove it, I interviewed the ultimate expert on games, a child. Hello there. Now, is it true that you are in fact, a real kid?
SUBJECT 11: Yes.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): And have you played hide and seek?
SUBJECT 11: Yes.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): And have you played tag?
SUBJECT 11: Yes.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Tell me, which one is better?
SUBJECT 11: Hide and seek by a mile.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Whoa, really? Why?
SUBJECT 11: I like hide and seek a lot more because you actually have to use your brain. If you're playing tag with someone who's faster than you, then they'll just keep winning. What fun is that?
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Indeed. Is there anything else you'd like to say?
SUBJECT 11: Well, as a professional kid, I'd like to say that hide and seek rules and tag, sadly, drools.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Wow, what an excellent point. Wouldn't you say so, weird, other Peter?
PETER MCNERNEY: I would!
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Hey, how come I never noticed that there are two of me? Where have you been this whole time?
PETER MCNERNEY: I was hiding.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Oh, ho, ho, nice! Anyway, hide and seek really is the universal game, stretching from antiquity all the way to our modern age. Back to you, original Peter, still playing that game of hide and seek.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
PETER MCNERNEY: Thanks, Peter. Wow, this really is a great game and one that I refuse to stop playing until Gary admits defeat. I think he's close.
SUBJECT 8: Ugh! Fine! I give up. You win, Peter. Are you happy? Come out, come out wherever you are!
PETER MCNERNEY: OK, here I go. I'm right here!
SUBJECT 8: [GASPS] Peter, were you hiding in the toilet?
PETER MCNERNEY: Yes, for four days!
SUBJECT 8: Didn't anyone have to use the bathroom in that time?
PETER MCNERNEY: Um, [CLEARS THROAT] well, I win!
SUBJECT 8: Ugh!
MOLLY BLOOM: Wow, Peter really does love hide and seek, going to amazing lengths to win.
TRUMAN: Sounds like no way helmed the amount of Peter's that are there.
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] Absolutely. Now, Truman, what stood out to you about Peter's Declaration of Greatness?
TRUMAN: I really did like the Minecraft reference. I thought it was like a perfect timing. And it was just very immersive in a way.
MOLLY BLOOM: Mhm.
TRUMAN: And then the sprinkled in like, extremes of hide and seek I really liked. Four days is a long time.
MOLLY BLOOM: All right, Nick, it is time for your rebuttal. Tell us why hide and seek is super weak. You've got 30 seconds. And go!
NICK CANALES: Great. Well, Peter said it himself. Hide and seek, the game where you can't go to the bathroom. You got to hold it the entire time. What a wonderful way to just feel in pain. Also, that kid sounded an awful lot like Peter's child. I wonder if they're biased at all. I don't know, I hope Peter's taking care of him. And also, the whole conversation about you got to find a saber tooth tiger. Well, then you got to catch it, and that part would be tag. Hide and go seek is kind of the preamble, and it is the only game where you could fall asleep while you're playing it.
MOLLY BLOOM: And time.
PETER MCNERNEY: Oh, you can't go to the bathroom? Did you listen to the argument, Nick? I hid in the toilet. I could go whenever I wanted to.
NICK CANALES: You hid in the toilet?
PETER MCNERNEY: That's the fun of hide and seek, is that you can-- let's not get too specific. We already made a serious potty humor joke. But you know what? Let us not forget, half of tag is seeking, a.k.a. catching you. It's already in the game, more complex. [MAKES EXPLOSION SOUND] That was a sound effect, just to sound exciting.
TRUMAN: [LAUGHS] Have you ever thought of hide and seek tag?
MOLLY BLOOM: Ohh!
PETER MCNERNEY: It is a variation of hide and seek.
TRUMAN: That is true.
NICK CANALES: I would call that a variation of tag, because you have to finish with the tag.
TRUMAN: That's true.
NICK CANALES: The tag is the finish.
PETER MCNERNEY: Oh no, are we becoming friends? No! Let's make up a game!
MOLLY BLOOM: Truman, it is time to award some points. Please give one point to the Declaration of Greatness that you liked best, and one point to the rebuttal that won you over. You get to decide what makes a winning argument. Did one team's jokes make you giggle? Was another team's logic impeccable? Award your points, but don't tell us who they're going to.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Have you made your decision?
TRUMAN: I have.
[BELL DINGS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Wonderful. Peter and Nick, how are you two feeling so far?
PETER MCNERNEY: I'm feeling pretty good. I do feel bad. I've been yelling at Nick. I just want to pause and say that Nick is my best friend, and I love you.
NICK CANALES: I would echo what Peter has said. I would love to play either hide and go seek or tag with Peter. I feel like I should yell more.
[LAUGHS]
MOLLY BLOOM: It is time for a quick break. Stretch out your calves or close your eyes and count to 10.
TRUMAN: And we'll be right back with more Smash Boom Best.
SUBJECT 12: You're listening to State of Debate, home to raging in rhetoric and awe inspiring argumentation.
TODD DOUGLAS: Hello, debate fans. I'm Todd Douglas and I'm here with the one and only--
TAYLOR LINCOLN: Taylor Lincoln. And lucky me, because I just hooked a big, old logical fallacy.
TODD DOUGLAS: Logical fallacies are debate mistakes that make your argument weaker.
TAYLOR LINCOLN: I just saw someone using the special pleading fallacy. That's when a person asks for an exception to be made for their side, without any support to back it up.
TODD DOUGLAS: Let's take a listen.
SUBJECT 13: Thanks for fishing with me, Jessie. I've been dying to test out this new bait I've been developing.
SUBJECT 14: No problem, James. Besides, I've been dying to go fishing for months.
SUBJECT 13: What's been keeping you?
SUBJECT 14: It's really hard to get a fishing permit this year. Without a permit, you're not allowed to fish. But luckily, I was able to get one yesterday.
SUBJECT 13: Oh yeah, those permits sure are important for conserving wildlife. Every angler should get one.
SUBJECT 14: Exactly. Hey, when did you get your permit?
SUBJECT 13: Oh, me? Oh, no. I never got one, but I think we'll be OK.
SUBJECT 14: What? But you just said people should have them.
SUBJECT 13: Yeah, but I'm a really good fisherman. I think I'll be fine if I don't get one. You know what I mean? Besides, what could go wrong if it's just one guy doesn't have a permit?
[BUZZER SOUND]
TAYLOR LINCOLN: Woof, we're going to need a bigger boat for a logical fallacy this large.
TODD DOUGLAS: James knows having a fishing permit is really important, so it's unfair that he didn't get one himself.
TAYLOR LINCOLN: That's right. You're not allowed to fish without a permit but he wants a special exception because he's good at fishing.
TODD DOUGLAS: That's a fishy excuse to me.
TAYLOR LINCOLN: Exactly, James should have gotten a permit like Jessie did before they hit the lake.
TODD DOUGLAS: Wow, all this fishing talk has put me in the mood for some seafood. How about you, Taylor?
TAYLOR LINCOLN: Ooh, I'm always open for a fine filet of fish. We'll see you next time on State of Debate.
NARRATOR: Brains On! Universe is a family of podcasts for kids and their adults. Since you're a fan of Smash Boom Best, you'll love the other shows in our universe. Come on, let's explore.
[PLANE SOUND EFFECT]
SUBJECT 15: Its Alien Exercise hour! Hi ya! Hoo ha! While I stretch my snootles and bounce on my trampoline, I'll listen to a new podcast. [LAUGHS] I'm going to try Brains On!, the best science podcast ever!
NARRATOR: It's starting! Yay!
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SUBJECT 16: Hello, and welcome to Pop Planet, the only show that gets you up close and personal with space. I'm your host, Star Eden--
SUBJECT 15: Zorp! Come back here, podcast! Must listen to Brains On! now!
NARRATOR: Listen to Brains On! wherever you get your podcasts.
SUBJECT 17: Smash Boom Best.
MOLLY BLOOM: You're listening to Smash Boom Best. I'm your host, Molly Bloom.
TRUMAN: And I'm your judge, Truman.
MOLLY BLOOM: And we love getting debate suggestions from our listeners. Take a listen to this adventurous debate idea.
SUBJECT 18: Hello, my name is Isaiah, and I'm from Europe, even though I live in New York City. And my debate is Harry Potter versus Indiana Jones.
TRUMAN: Ooh, a battle of wands and whips.
MOLLY BLOOM: We'll check back in at the end of this episode to see which side Isaiah thinks should win.
TRUMAN: And now, it's back to our debate, tag versus hide and seek.
MOLLY BLOOM: That's right, and it's time for round two the--
NARRATOR: Micro Round.
MOLLY BLOOM: For the Micro Round challenge, each team has prepared a creative response to a prompt they received in advance. For Nick and Peter, the prompt was top of the hour, where each debater has to fill us in on the latest breaking news about their side. Nick went first last time so Peter, you're up. Give us the breaking news on hide and seek.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SUBJECT 19: And now, we go to our reporter in the field, Trip Graslie. Trip.
TRIP GRASLIE: Thanks, Ted. I'm here in a small town rocked by a not so small tragedy. A beloved part of their annual fall festival is a village wide game of hide and seek and unfortunately, it seems the most obnoxious member of this community is about to win. Ma'am, how are the people feeling?
SUBJECT 20: Ugh, we're obviously devastated. We've been searching for days, but there's no sign of Devon.
TRIP GRASLIE: Now, as I understand it, normally, not finding Devon is a good thing?
SUBJECT 20: Yes, he's incredibly annoying, and he finds a way to gloat about literally everything. If he won, he'd totally rub our faces in it. Frankly, we're heartbroken by the idea that he's about to win.
TRIP GRASLIE: Wow, so despite all that, I guess you would have to say that Devon is officially the best hider in town?
SUBJECT 20: I don't know how I came to this but yes, I must admit, he's very good at hiding. Just please don't tell him I said that.
TRIP GRASLIE: Ha, well, it's too late!
SUBJECT 20: What?
TRIP GRASLIE: Fake mustache!
SUBJECT 20: Devon!
TRIP GRASLIE: Ha ha, baby! You said it, I'm the best! Woo! Ha! I'm the lord of hiding. In your face! In your face!
SUBJECT 20: You are so obnoxious!
TRIP GRASLIE: I think you mean so good at hiding. Ha ha ha ha ha! Ho ho ho ho ho ho! Ha ha ha ha ha! [CLEARS THROAT] Back to you in the studio.
SUBJECT 19: Wow, annoying.
MOLLY BLOOM: Wow. [LAUGHS] Nick, now it's your turn to give us your top of the hour on tag.
JAMES CRANBERRY: Welcome back to the News at Nine. I'm James Cranberry with tonight's top story. There's a brand new sensation sweeping through the nation known as It. Scientists aren't exactly sure what It is, but it's clear that It is a lot of fun. Those who come down with this curious condition are overcome with a sense of thrill and a primitive urge to pass It on. For more, here's Robert Laundrie in the field. Robert.
ROBERT LAUNDRIE: Hi, James. I'm here with Tabitha Woodpile, who claims that she was briefly It. Tabitha, tell us about your experience.
TABITHA WOODPILE: It was wild. I was myself, but then the next thing I knew, I felt this, this light touch on my shoulder. And then, I knew I was It and I had this powerful urge to pass It on. It was like I was a lioness or a cheetah.
ROBERT LAUNDRIE: But what was IT you were trying to pass on?
TABITHA WOODPILE: I don't know, but I know IT was making me and everyone around me laugh and run around and yell like wild.
[RUNNING FOOTSTEP SOUND]
Uh oh, I think that guy's IT. Gotta run! [LAUGHS] Ah! I love tag so much!
SUBJECT 21: Ha ha! You're it.
ROBERT LAUNDRIE: Uh oh, it appears that now I am IT. I don't know what to say other than, I got to go catch someone! Back to you, James! Wee! [LAUGHS] This is the best day of my life! [LAUGHS]
[MUSIC PLAYING]
MOLLY BLOOM: OK, these games are so fun that even the newscasters have to play. Truman, what did you like about Nick and Peter's Micro Rounds?
TRUMAN: Ooh, I liked that both of them were like, everybody's involved.
MOLLY BLOOM: Mm, absolutely.
TRUMAN: And I'd love to know more about this IT. Like, did it start with one person, and every country has IT. And if one person is IT and they tag another person, does the person who tagged the other person stay IT?
MOLLY BLOOM: We need a 12 part investigative podcast series, I think. All right, Truman, it is time to award a point.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Have you made your decision?
TRUMAN: I have.
[BELL DINGS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Fantastic. Then, it's time for our third round, the super stealthy Sneak Attack! This is our improvised round where debaters have to respond to a challenge on the spot. Today's Sneak Attack is called Sonic Stealth. For this challenge, we want you to come up with a version of your game that could be played with just sound. Again, your game should be audio only as this is a podcast. We want you to name your sound game inspired by your side, explain it, then, let's play it. Debaters, does this make sense?
NICK CANALES: I believe it does.
PETER MCNERNEY: Yes.
MOLLY BLOOM: OK, we're going to start with Nick.
NICK CANALES: I would like to play a brand new version of tag called T tag. The way that it works is one person is IT, and they're trying to listen for the tah. Everybody else says, T. Whenever you say T, you can't be caught. But as soon as somebody says tah, the person who's IT has to say tah before they can say T again, and then that person becomes IT.
MOLLY BLOOM: Ooh.
NICK CANALES: All right. So, great. I'll be IT to start. So everyone else can only say T. As soon as I hear somebody say tah, I can tag them if I say tah before somebody else says T again.
MOLLY BLOOM: Whoa, OK. Do we take turns saying T?
NICK CANALES: Yeah, you can all say T as many times as you want, but if I hear a tah and I say tah, that person who tah'ed is IT.
MOLLY BLOOM: OK.
TRUMAN: OK.
MOLLY BLOOM: I'm ready.
TRUMAN: I'm partially ready, yes.
MOLLY BLOOM: On your marks, get set, go!
PETER MCNERNEY: I sort of get it.
MOLLY BLOOM: T.
TRUMAN: T.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tah.
NICK CANALES: Tah!
MOLLY BLOOM: T.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tah.
NICK CANALES: Tah, tah. No, no, I tah'ed the tah.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tah.
MOLLY BLOOM: T
NICK CANALES: I tah'ed the tah. I tah'ed--
TRUMAN: T.
NICK CANALES: No, no. I tah'ed the tah--
TRUMAN: T.
NICK CANALES: --and I'm pretty sure it was Peter's voice.
PETER MCNERNEY: You didn't tah the tah the tah.
MOLLY BLOOM: T. [LAUGHS]
NICK CANALES: I tah'ed Peter's tah.
PETER MCNERNEY: I tah'ed the tah the tah the tah.
NICK CANALES: Stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop.
TRUMAN: Tah, T.
NICK CANALES: New round, new round.
PETER MCNERNEY: I can't stop saying tah!
NICK CANALES: New round!
[LAUGHS]
Peter's-- Peter's the new tah'er. Peters IT. I tah'ed his tah.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tah.
NICK CANALES: I tah'ed your tah, Peter.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tah.
TRUMAN: T.
NICK CANALES: You tah'ed early and I tah'ed it. All right.
MOLLY BLOOM: OK, you tah'ed it.
PETER MCNERNEY: Who's tah'ed?
NICK CANALES: Tah'ed is IT. IT is tah'ed. Tah'ed is IT.
TRUMAN: So, T, tahdy.
PETER MCNERNEY: Yeah, and you tah'ed it well.
NICK CANALES: I'm glad that I tah'ed you well. Good.
MOLLY BLOOM: That was very good.
NICK CANALES: I'm glad I tah'ed it well. Thank you.
[LAUGHS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Excellent work. That was fun. I want to play that again. All right, Peter, it is your turn. Let's hear about your new audio only version of hide and seek.
PETER MCNERNEY: My audio only version of hide and seek is very simple. We all close our eyes and in your mind, if you're the hider, you decide where you want to hide. And then you say guess where I'm hiding, but in a voice that makes it sound like you're in that space.
[LAUGHS]
And then, you have to guess what kind of space I'm in. For example, I'm going to pick in my mind a suitcase. And then, we go, all right, ready. We go, [MUFFLED SHOUTING] I'm hiding! Come find me!
[LAUGHS]
And then you say, are you in a box? [MUFFLED SHOUTING] Nope, I'm not in a box.
NICK CANALES: All right, great. I'm ready, I'm ready.
MOLLY BLOOM: OK. Yeah, you guys should play this.
NICK CANALES: All right, ready?
PETER MCNERNEY: All right.
MOLLY BLOOM: Yeah.
NICK CANALES: All right, are you ready? [TURKEY GOBBLING SOUNDS]
PETER MCNERNEY: Are you hiding or--
NICK CANALES: Guess where I'm hiding? [TURKEY GOBBLING SOUNDS]
[LAUGHS]
PETER MCNERNEY: In a turkey?
[LAUGHS]
NICK CANALES: No, I was underwater.
TRUMAN: Underwater?
NICK CANALES: Underwater, underwater. Yes, yes, Truman is correct.
TRUMAN: I was right, I was right.
NICK CANALES: Points for Truman. Truman's-- Truman's the seeker.
TRUMAN: Huzzah.
MOLLY BLOOM: Truman found you.
PETER MCNERNEY: [MUFFLED SHOUTING] I am trapped in a suitcase and I can't get out.
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS]
NICK CANALES: Are you in a suitcase and you can't get out?
PETER MCNERNEY: That's not really easy to do.
[LAUGHS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Oh my gosh, these are both so fun. So we've got two excellent games here. We've got T, tah tag--
TRUMAN: [LAUGHS] T, tah.
MOLLY BLOOM: --and the audio version of hide and seek. We've got guess where I'm hiding. It is very tough.
TRUMAN: It's very tough.
PETER MCNERNEY: I'm going to call the game, can you hear where I'm hiding?
MOLLY BLOOM: Ooh, love it. OK, so we've got T, tah tag and can you hear where I'm hiding? I need you, Truman, to award a point to your favorite game.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
TRUMAN: I'm awarding.
[BELL DINGS]
MOLLY BLOOM: It is time for our final round, The Final Six. In this round, each team will have just six words to sum up the glory of their side. Peter, let's hear your six words for the heart pounding hide and seek.
PETER MCNERNEY: Ready or not, here comes fun!
[LAUGHS]
TRUMAN: I applaud you.
MOLLY BLOOM: Oh, excellent, excellent. OK, Nick, it's your turn. Give us six words that will help you brag about tag.
NICK CANALES: Why hide? Have more fun. Run!
[LAUGHS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Oh, man. Two really good Final Sixes there. But Truman, only one of them can receive your final point.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Have you made your decision?
TRUMAN: Yes.
[BELL DINGS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Are you ready to crown one team the Smash Boom Best?
TRUMAN: I am.
MOLLY BLOOM: All right. Drumroll, please. And the winner is--
TRUMAN: It is hide and seek.
PETER MCNERNEY: Yay!
NICK CANALES: Fair. Fair. Fair enough.
PETER MCNERNEY: I'll take it!
TRUMAN: It was very close.
PETER MCNERNEY: I'll take it.
NICK CANALES: Congrats.
TRUMAN: It came down to the Final Six. And ready or not, here I come is such a classic. But adding the fun, it was just-- it was--
PETER MCNERNEY: Here comes fun.
TRUMAN: --perfect. I loved it and I forgot that that was six words, so I thought it was really clever.
MOLLY BLOOM: Nicely done, both of you.
PETER MCNERNEY: What I enjoyed about Nick's performance was, besides every single second of it, thinking about it later, I also loved that. Nick, you did make me want to run around and for that, thank you. And your presence makes everything better.
MOLLY BLOOM: Aww.
TRUMAN: Aww.
NICK CANALES: Thanks, Peter. I feel like I won, even though I lost. Wow. I'm blown away by Peter's creativity. Just hearing him do all the different voices was so fun. I think that game, guess where I'm hiding now, is brilliant. I think we're going to hopefully play it constantly on road trips.
PETER MCNERNEY: Oh, we're going to play it.
NICK CANALES: I just want to keep. I just want to keep playing that game. I could play that all day. It sounds so fun. I found Peter's performance of it very impressive. So I get it, I get it. I think he deserves the win.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
MOLLY BLOOM: Well, that's it for today's debate battle. Truman crowned hide and seek the Smash Boom Best, but what about you?
TRUMAN: Head to smashboom.org and vote to tell us who you think won.
MOLLY BLOOM: Smash Boom Best is brought to you by Brains On! and APM Studios. It's produced by Molly Bloom--
ANNA WEGGEL: Anna Weggel.
MOLLY BLOOM: And--
ARON WOLDESLASSIE: Aron Woldeslassie.
MOLLY BLOOM: We had engineering help from Alex Simpson and Gary O'Keefe with sound design by--
ANNA WEGGEL: Anna Weggel.
MOLLY BLOOM: Our editors are--
SHAHLA FARZAN: Shahla Farzan.
MOLLY BLOOM: And--
SANDEN TOTTEN: Sanden Totten.
MOLLY BLOOM: With fact checking by--
REBECCA RAND: Rebecca Rand.
MOLLY BLOOM: And we had production help from the rest of the Brains On! Universe team--
ROSIE DUPONT: Rosie DuPont.
RACHEL BREES: Rachel Brees.
ANNA GOLDFIELD: Anna Goldfield.
NICO GONZALEZ WISLER: Nico Gonzalez Wisler.
RUBY GUTHRIE: Ruby Guthrie.
LAUREN HUMBERT: Lauren Humbert.
JOSHUA RAY: Joshua Ray.
MARC SANCHEZ: Marc Sanchez.
MOLLY BLOOM: And--
CHARLOTTE TRAVER: Charlotte Traver.
MOLLY BLOOM: Our executive producer is Beth Perlman, and the APM Studios executives in charge are Chandra Kavati and Joanne Griffith. Our announcer is Marley Feuerwerker-Otto, and we want to give a special thanks to Austin Cross and Taylor Kaufman. Nick, is there anyone you'd like to give a shout out to today?
NICK CANALES: I'd like to give a shout out to my kids, RJ and Nico, and to the kids at PS 145 and 154.
MOLLY BLOOM: Woo hoo. And how about you, Peter? Any special shout outs?
PETER MCNERNEY: My kids, Brennan, Maybin, and their school, PS 11, across the street. Now you know where I live.
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] Oh, we love the Story Pirates. Truman, do you want to give any special thanks?
TRUMAN: I want to give a special thanks to my mom, my dad, and everybody who's helped me throughout my life.
MOLLY BLOOM: That is a beautiful thing.
TRUMAN: Smash Boom Best is a nonprofit public radio program.
MOLLY BLOOM: If you're between the ages of 13 and 18 and you'd like to be a judge, or if you're any age and you have an idea for a Knock Down Drag Out debate, head to smashboom.org/contact and drop us a line. And while you're at it, join Smarty Pass for bonus episodes and ad free versions of all four shows in the Brains On! Universe. We'll be back with a new Smash Boom Best debate battle next week. Frankenstein's monster versus Frosty the Snowman! Goodbye!
TRUMAN: See you later, alligator.
NICK CANALES: You're it!
PETER MCNERNEY: You're it! You're it! Gotcha! I was going to say the same thing.
NICK CANALES: Peter, that's hilarious.
[LAUGHS]
[MUSIC PLAYING]
(SINGING) Ooh, you're the Smash Boom Best
Ooh, put you through the test
Ooh, you're the Smash Boom Best
Ooh, better than the rest
It's the Smash Boom Best
It's the Smash Boom Best
NICK CANALES: Can you hear where I'm hiding?
MOLLY BLOOM: Yeah, go ahead.
NICK CANALES: [WOBBLY VOICE] Your problem is you're never going to find me. You're never going to find me.
[LAUGHS]
PETER MCNERNEY: Are you hiding inside the dream of an alien?
NICK CANALES: [WOBBLY VOICE] Close, no.
TRUMAN: Are you a free elf, Dobby?
NICK CANALES: [WOBBLY VOICE] Not quite.
MOLLY BLOOM: Are you inside a fan?
NICK CANALES: Yes, I was in a fan. Yeah, how'd you know that was it?
[LAUGHS]
[MUSIC PLAYING]
MOLLY BLOOM: Hi, I'm Molly Bloom and this is Smash Boom Best, the show where we take two things, smash them together, and ask you to decide which one is best. Today's debate is a fun filled face off between two timeless playground favorites. It's tag versus hide and seek. Story Pirate improviser and motion capture actor Nick Canales is here to demonstrate speed and agility for team tag.
NICK CANALES: No need to brag. It's the game that doesn't drag. It's more fun to play tag. Let's hear it for the tag team champions of the world!
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] And Story Pirate Peter McNerney is here with a heavy dose of stealth and strategy for team hide and seek.
PETER MCNERNEY: Your long search has ended, for you have found the greatest game in human history. It is hide and seek!
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] And here to judge it all is Truman from Stillwater, Minnesota. Truman is currently starring in his first professional musical, enjoys Dungeons and Dragons, and would one day love to be a Broadway actor who moonlights as a professional therapist. Hi, Truman.
TRUMAN: Hi!
MOLLY BLOOM: So, what is it like to be in a professional musical?
TRUMAN: It's so much fun. It's so cool being surrounded by the people you want to grow up to be.
MOLLY BLOOM: That sounds very, very cool. And what draws you in about being a therapist someday?
TRUMAN: My mom's a therapist, and I think it's just a really cool job because you get to help people. And I've always been intrigued about mental health. And I just think it's super interesting.
MOLLY BLOOM: That's great. And you've judged Smash Boom Best multiple times now.
TRUMAN: Yeah.
MOLLY BLOOM: Do you have any advice for our debaters today?
TRUMAN: Make me laugh and references.
MOLLY BLOOM: Hm, references and laughs. Will Truman side with Nick or Peter? Only time will tell. But first, here are the rules. Every debate consists of four rounds, the Declaration of Greatness, the Micro Round, the Sneak Attack, and the Final Six. After each round, our judge, Truman, will award points to the team that impresses him the most but he'll keep his decisions top secret until the end of the debate.
Listeners, we want you to judge too. Mark down your points as you listen. At the end of the show, head to our website, smashboom.org, and vote for whichever team you think won. OK, Nick, Peter, and Truman, are you ready?
TRUMAN: Yeah!
PETER MCNERNEY: Born ready.
NICK CANALES: Take the letter E, color it red.
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] Then, it's time for the--
NARRATOR: Declaration of Greatness.
MOLLY BLOOM: In this round, our debaters will present a well crafted, immersive argument in favor of their side. Then, they'll each have 30 seconds to rebut their opponent's statements. We flipped a coin and Nick, you're up first. Tell us what is so terrific about tag.
NICK CANALES: I love tag, it's easily my favorite game, but lately, I'm getting tagged way too often. So I decided to join my local gym to get in shape and up my game.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
By the way, did I mention this is a tag gym?
BRYCE CLINE: Yo! What's up, tag maniacs! My name is Bryce Cline, owner of The Fountain, a.k.a. the best tag gym Des Moines has to offer. Let me show you around. Over here, we've got slopes, rails, and a wicked jumping wall. Everything you need to practice death defying escapes from an epic tagger. Isn't that right, Lexi?
SUBJECT 1: For sure, Bryce.
BRYCE CLINE: Lexi is one of our best clients.
SUBJECT 1: Before I joined The Fountain, I played like an amateur, chasing taggers like a puppy chasing her tail. But now, I'm no puppy. I'm top dog. I used to be it. But now, I'm killing it, running it, flexing it, owning it. Ugh!
BRYCE CLINE: We're so happy you came by to check out the place, Nick. Sign up today and the first month's free. And if you catch me, the second month's free. But you won't!
NICK CANALES: Wow! I can't wait to up my tag game. In case you've been living under a rock, which is sadly a winning hide and seek strategy, tag is a worldwide phenomenon that people have been playing for centuries. Besides being super fun, tag is really good for you. It gets your heart pumping, it requires speed, quick reflexes, and helps you master the art of watching several targets at once. And humans aren't the only ones who love playing tag. Scientists have noticed that young gorillas also play a version of this classic game. Tag is so beloved it's even played by other species.
SUBJECT 2: Hey, Jill, do you want to play tag like a silverback gorilla? Or would you rather play hide and seek like that turtle?
SUBJECT 3: Tag! Tag! I love gorillas!
NICK CANALES: Not only is the game fun, but there are a ton of different ways to play tag, like freeze tag where you get tagged and stay still until someone unfreezes you, or TV tag where you can avoid getting tagged if you say the name of a TV show. Or my favorite, Smash Boom Best tag. It's just like TV tag, but you share a fact about Molly.
SUBJECT 4: Tag, you're it.
SUBJECT 5: Oh wait, Molly Bloom has a phobia of birds named Kevin.
SUBJECT 4: Oh man, you're right.
NICK CANALES: There's also octopus tag, hot dog tag, blob tag, Star Wars tag, and more. And if you get really good, you can play tag professionally.
[TRUMPET SOUND EFFECT]
World chase tag is a competitive sport where two teams race to tag each other in an arena filled with obstacles. It's played internationally and has killer rounds like chase off's and sudden death chase offs. That's for players who are really good at tag. You want to know what happens if you get good at hide and seek? You go missing.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Hide and seek requires a lot of space, dark and musty, old places to hide. But you can play tag anywhere with anyone. You could even play on the moon.
SUBJECT 6: That's one small step for man, one giant leap for mankind.
SUBJECT 7: Tag, you're it, Neil!
SUBJECT 6: Ah! You rascal! Get over here!
SUBJECT 7: Uh, Houston, we have a problem. Neil is never going to catch me.
NICK CANALES: Whether you're playing in a gym, a playground, or outer space, any place is a perfect space for our game of chase, tag. Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to catch Bryce because you know I'm not going to pay full price for that gym membership.
BRYCE CLINE: You're never going to catch me, dude!
NICK CANALES: Yes, I am! [LAUGHS] Come here, Bryce! He's really good at this. He's fast.
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] You just had to mention Kevin, my phobia of birds named Kevin. I don't know if I can go on in this taping. Oh, Nick, what an excellent job. Truman, what stood out to you about Nick's Declaration of Greatness?
TRUMAN: I liked the switch of scenes. It was like the perfect amount of each scene where I could see it in my head. I loved it. The wording was great, and tag is a go to.
MOLLY BLOOM: Mhm, it's true. Peter, it is time for your rebuttal. Tell us why tag is just a red flag. You've got 30 seconds, and your time starts now.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tag? Tag? Really? That's a fun game. You know what I call tag? I call it running around. Ooh! The strategy. Oh, guess what? I'm faster than you. You're it. Game's over. Yeah, that gym thing was very apt because who wants to go to the gym? That's what tag is. Exercise, just exercise. I need to be distracted in my exercise and tag does not do the job. Tag, no one's it!
MOLLY BLOOM: And time. [LAUGHS]
NICK CANALES: I don't really understand why Peter doesn't like to exercise. I think exercising is fun, and I think tag is the perfect way to trick yourself into exercising.
MOLLY BLOOM: OK, it is your turn, Peter. Tell us why hide and seek is so unique.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
PETER MCNERNEY: [LAUGHING] Oh, hi, everyone. Sorry to whisper but I'm in the middle of playing the greatest game of all time, hide and seek. And well, things may have gotten a little out of hand.
SUBJECT 8: Peter, where are you? You've been hiding for four days!
PETER MCNERNEY: [LAUGHS] That's my friend Gary. We're very competitive. Neither one of us has slept since the game began. [LAUGHS] [SNORES] Ah!
SUBJECT 8: Ah! What was that? You're clearly right here in this cookie jar! Ha!
PETER MCNERNEY: [LAUGHS]
SUBJECT 8: What? You're not in here. This jar is full of delicious cookies in the, shape of your face? Did you make these just to mock me?
PETER MCNERNEY: I did.
SUBJECT 8: You'll never defeat me, Peter. I'll find you!
PETER MCNERNEY: Wow, this game rules! But why? Why is the simple act of hiding or seeking so fun? To answer that question, here's me, recorded earlier, when I wasn't hiding in an incredibly cramped spot Peter.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Thanks, Peter. Hi, everyone. Now, you're probably wondering, what am I doing in this idyllic forest untouched by civilization. Is it to set the scene for what life was like for our paleolithic hunter gatherer ancestors? Wow, good guess. It is! You see, we as humans are hardwired to search for stuff, to seek for animals, for plants to eat, for shelter, for water, or any other thing that you might file under need to live. If your great, great, greatest of great grandparents didn't have treasure hunting brains, you probably wouldn't be here.
SUBJECT 9: Hey, Gurks, are you coming? Time to hunt saber toothed tiger.
SUBJECT 10: Oh, shoot. That's today?
SUBJECT 9: Yeah, what? You have something else to do?
SUBJECT 10: Uh, I thought maybe I'd just relax and do some Minecraft.
SUBJECT 9: You mean dig for stones and minerals?
SUBJECT 10: Yeah, what else would I mean?
SUBJECT 9: I don't know. Well, good luck not eating. Bye!
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): So the urge to hide and seek is likely what helped humans survive and thrive.
PETER MCNERNEY: Whoa, so you're saying it's not just for fun, it's important?
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Yes, I am, inexplicable other Peter.
PETER MCNERNEY: This is so cool.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): I know, that's why even to this day, we love to play hide and seek. And to prove it, I interviewed the ultimate expert on games, a child. Hello there. Now, is it true that you are in fact, a real kid?
SUBJECT 11: Yes.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): And have you played hide and seek?
SUBJECT 11: Yes.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): And have you played tag?
SUBJECT 11: Yes.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Tell me, which one is better?
SUBJECT 11: Hide and seek by a mile.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Whoa, really? Why?
SUBJECT 11: I like hide and seek a lot more because you actually have to use your brain. If you're playing tag with someone who's faster than you, then they'll just keep winning. What fun is that?
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Indeed. Is there anything else you'd like to say?
SUBJECT 11: Well, as a professional kid, I'd like to say that hide and seek rules and tag, sadly, drools.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Wow, what an excellent point. Wouldn't you say so, weird, other Peter?
PETER MCNERNEY: I would!
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Hey, how come I never noticed that there are two of me? Where have you been this whole time?
PETER MCNERNEY: I was hiding.
PETER MCNERNEY (FROM THE PAST): Oh, ho, ho, nice! Anyway, hide and seek really is the universal game, stretching from antiquity all the way to our modern age. Back to you, original Peter, still playing that game of hide and seek.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
PETER MCNERNEY: Thanks, Peter. Wow, this really is a great game and one that I refuse to stop playing until Gary admits defeat. I think he's close.
SUBJECT 8: Ugh! Fine! I give up. You win, Peter. Are you happy? Come out, come out wherever you are!
PETER MCNERNEY: OK, here I go. I'm right here!
SUBJECT 8: [GASPS] Peter, were you hiding in the toilet?
PETER MCNERNEY: Yes, for four days!
SUBJECT 8: Didn't anyone have to use the bathroom in that time?
PETER MCNERNEY: Um, [CLEARS THROAT] well, I win!
SUBJECT 8: Ugh!
MOLLY BLOOM: Wow, Peter really does love hide and seek, going to amazing lengths to win.
TRUMAN: Sounds like no way helmed the amount of Peter's that are there.
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] Absolutely. Now, Truman, what stood out to you about Peter's Declaration of Greatness?
TRUMAN: I really did like the Minecraft reference. I thought it was like a perfect timing. And it was just very immersive in a way.
MOLLY BLOOM: Mhm.
TRUMAN: And then the sprinkled in like, extremes of hide and seek I really liked. Four days is a long time.
MOLLY BLOOM: All right, Nick, it is time for your rebuttal. Tell us why hide and seek is super weak. You've got 30 seconds. And go!
NICK CANALES: Great. Well, Peter said it himself. Hide and seek, the game where you can't go to the bathroom. You got to hold it the entire time. What a wonderful way to just feel in pain. Also, that kid sounded an awful lot like Peter's child. I wonder if they're biased at all. I don't know, I hope Peter's taking care of him. And also, the whole conversation about you got to find a saber tooth tiger. Well, then you got to catch it, and that part would be tag. Hide and go seek is kind of the preamble, and it is the only game where you could fall asleep while you're playing it.
MOLLY BLOOM: And time.
PETER MCNERNEY: Oh, you can't go to the bathroom? Did you listen to the argument, Nick? I hid in the toilet. I could go whenever I wanted to.
NICK CANALES: You hid in the toilet?
PETER MCNERNEY: That's the fun of hide and seek, is that you can-- let's not get too specific. We already made a serious potty humor joke. But you know what? Let us not forget, half of tag is seeking, a.k.a. catching you. It's already in the game, more complex. [MAKES EXPLOSION SOUND] That was a sound effect, just to sound exciting.
TRUMAN: [LAUGHS] Have you ever thought of hide and seek tag?
MOLLY BLOOM: Ohh!
PETER MCNERNEY: It is a variation of hide and seek.
TRUMAN: That is true.
NICK CANALES: I would call that a variation of tag, because you have to finish with the tag.
TRUMAN: That's true.
NICK CANALES: The tag is the finish.
PETER MCNERNEY: Oh no, are we becoming friends? No! Let's make up a game!
MOLLY BLOOM: Truman, it is time to award some points. Please give one point to the Declaration of Greatness that you liked best, and one point to the rebuttal that won you over. You get to decide what makes a winning argument. Did one team's jokes make you giggle? Was another team's logic impeccable? Award your points, but don't tell us who they're going to.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Have you made your decision?
TRUMAN: I have.
[BELL DINGS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Wonderful. Peter and Nick, how are you two feeling so far?
PETER MCNERNEY: I'm feeling pretty good. I do feel bad. I've been yelling at Nick. I just want to pause and say that Nick is my best friend, and I love you.
NICK CANALES: I would echo what Peter has said. I would love to play either hide and go seek or tag with Peter. I feel like I should yell more.
[LAUGHS]
MOLLY BLOOM: It is time for a quick break. Stretch out your calves or close your eyes and count to 10.
TRUMAN: And we'll be right back with more Smash Boom Best.
SUBJECT 12: You're listening to State of Debate, home to raging in rhetoric and awe inspiring argumentation.
TODD DOUGLAS: Hello, debate fans. I'm Todd Douglas and I'm here with the one and only--
TAYLOR LINCOLN: Taylor Lincoln. And lucky me, because I just hooked a big, old logical fallacy.
TODD DOUGLAS: Logical fallacies are debate mistakes that make your argument weaker.
TAYLOR LINCOLN: I just saw someone using the special pleading fallacy. That's when a person asks for an exception to be made for their side, without any support to back it up.
TODD DOUGLAS: Let's take a listen.
SUBJECT 13: Thanks for fishing with me, Jessie. I've been dying to test out this new bait I've been developing.
SUBJECT 14: No problem, James. Besides, I've been dying to go fishing for months.
SUBJECT 13: What's been keeping you?
SUBJECT 14: It's really hard to get a fishing permit this year. Without a permit, you're not allowed to fish. But luckily, I was able to get one yesterday.
SUBJECT 13: Oh yeah, those permits sure are important for conserving wildlife. Every angler should get one.
SUBJECT 14: Exactly. Hey, when did you get your permit?
SUBJECT 13: Oh, me? Oh, no. I never got one, but I think we'll be OK.
SUBJECT 14: What? But you just said people should have them.
SUBJECT 13: Yeah, but I'm a really good fisherman. I think I'll be fine if I don't get one. You know what I mean? Besides, what could go wrong if it's just one guy doesn't have a permit?
[BUZZER SOUND]
TAYLOR LINCOLN: Woof, we're going to need a bigger boat for a logical fallacy this large.
TODD DOUGLAS: James knows having a fishing permit is really important, so it's unfair that he didn't get one himself.
TAYLOR LINCOLN: That's right. You're not allowed to fish without a permit but he wants a special exception because he's good at fishing.
TODD DOUGLAS: That's a fishy excuse to me.
TAYLOR LINCOLN: Exactly, James should have gotten a permit like Jessie did before they hit the lake.
TODD DOUGLAS: Wow, all this fishing talk has put me in the mood for some seafood. How about you, Taylor?
TAYLOR LINCOLN: Ooh, I'm always open for a fine filet of fish. We'll see you next time on State of Debate.
NARRATOR: Brains On! Universe is a family of podcasts for kids and their adults. Since you're a fan of Smash Boom Best, you'll love the other shows in our universe. Come on, let's explore.
[PLANE SOUND EFFECT]
SUBJECT 15: Its Alien Exercise hour! Hi ya! Hoo ha! While I stretch my snootles and bounce on my trampoline, I'll listen to a new podcast. [LAUGHS] I'm going to try Brains On!, the best science podcast ever!
NARRATOR: It's starting! Yay!
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SUBJECT 16: Hello, and welcome to Pop Planet, the only show that gets you up close and personal with space. I'm your host, Star Eden--
SUBJECT 15: Zorp! Come back here, podcast! Must listen to Brains On! now!
NARRATOR: Listen to Brains On! wherever you get your podcasts.
SUBJECT 17: Smash Boom Best.
MOLLY BLOOM: You're listening to Smash Boom Best. I'm your host, Molly Bloom.
TRUMAN: And I'm your judge, Truman.
MOLLY BLOOM: And we love getting debate suggestions from our listeners. Take a listen to this adventurous debate idea.
SUBJECT 18: Hello, my name is Isaiah, and I'm from Europe, even though I live in New York City. And my debate is Harry Potter versus Indiana Jones.
TRUMAN: Ooh, a battle of wands and whips.
MOLLY BLOOM: We'll check back in at the end of this episode to see which side Isaiah thinks should win.
TRUMAN: And now, it's back to our debate, tag versus hide and seek.
MOLLY BLOOM: That's right, and it's time for round two the--
NARRATOR: Micro Round.
MOLLY BLOOM: For the Micro Round challenge, each team has prepared a creative response to a prompt they received in advance. For Nick and Peter, the prompt was top of the hour, where each debater has to fill us in on the latest breaking news about their side. Nick went first last time so Peter, you're up. Give us the breaking news on hide and seek.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SUBJECT 19: And now, we go to our reporter in the field, Trip Graslie. Trip.
TRIP GRASLIE: Thanks, Ted. I'm here in a small town rocked by a not so small tragedy. A beloved part of their annual fall festival is a village wide game of hide and seek and unfortunately, it seems the most obnoxious member of this community is about to win. Ma'am, how are the people feeling?
SUBJECT 20: Ugh, we're obviously devastated. We've been searching for days, but there's no sign of Devon.
TRIP GRASLIE: Now, as I understand it, normally, not finding Devon is a good thing?
SUBJECT 20: Yes, he's incredibly annoying, and he finds a way to gloat about literally everything. If he won, he'd totally rub our faces in it. Frankly, we're heartbroken by the idea that he's about to win.
TRIP GRASLIE: Wow, so despite all that, I guess you would have to say that Devon is officially the best hider in town?
SUBJECT 20: I don't know how I came to this but yes, I must admit, he's very good at hiding. Just please don't tell him I said that.
TRIP GRASLIE: Ha, well, it's too late!
SUBJECT 20: What?
TRIP GRASLIE: Fake mustache!
SUBJECT 20: Devon!
TRIP GRASLIE: Ha ha, baby! You said it, I'm the best! Woo! Ha! I'm the lord of hiding. In your face! In your face!
SUBJECT 20: You are so obnoxious!
TRIP GRASLIE: I think you mean so good at hiding. Ha ha ha ha ha! Ho ho ho ho ho ho! Ha ha ha ha ha! [CLEARS THROAT] Back to you in the studio.
SUBJECT 19: Wow, annoying.
MOLLY BLOOM: Wow. [LAUGHS] Nick, now it's your turn to give us your top of the hour on tag.
JAMES CRANBERRY: Welcome back to the News at Nine. I'm James Cranberry with tonight's top story. There's a brand new sensation sweeping through the nation known as It. Scientists aren't exactly sure what It is, but it's clear that It is a lot of fun. Those who come down with this curious condition are overcome with a sense of thrill and a primitive urge to pass It on. For more, here's Robert Laundrie in the field. Robert.
ROBERT LAUNDRIE: Hi, James. I'm here with Tabitha Woodpile, who claims that she was briefly It. Tabitha, tell us about your experience.
TABITHA WOODPILE: It was wild. I was myself, but then the next thing I knew, I felt this, this light touch on my shoulder. And then, I knew I was It and I had this powerful urge to pass It on. It was like I was a lioness or a cheetah.
ROBERT LAUNDRIE: But what was IT you were trying to pass on?
TABITHA WOODPILE: I don't know, but I know IT was making me and everyone around me laugh and run around and yell like wild.
[RUNNING FOOTSTEP SOUND]
Uh oh, I think that guy's IT. Gotta run! [LAUGHS] Ah! I love tag so much!
SUBJECT 21: Ha ha! You're it.
ROBERT LAUNDRIE: Uh oh, it appears that now I am IT. I don't know what to say other than, I got to go catch someone! Back to you, James! Wee! [LAUGHS] This is the best day of my life! [LAUGHS]
[MUSIC PLAYING]
MOLLY BLOOM: OK, these games are so fun that even the newscasters have to play. Truman, what did you like about Nick and Peter's Micro Rounds?
TRUMAN: Ooh, I liked that both of them were like, everybody's involved.
MOLLY BLOOM: Mm, absolutely.
TRUMAN: And I'd love to know more about this IT. Like, did it start with one person, and every country has IT. And if one person is IT and they tag another person, does the person who tagged the other person stay IT?
MOLLY BLOOM: We need a 12 part investigative podcast series, I think. All right, Truman, it is time to award a point.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Have you made your decision?
TRUMAN: I have.
[BELL DINGS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Fantastic. Then, it's time for our third round, the super stealthy Sneak Attack! This is our improvised round where debaters have to respond to a challenge on the spot. Today's Sneak Attack is called Sonic Stealth. For this challenge, we want you to come up with a version of your game that could be played with just sound. Again, your game should be audio only as this is a podcast. We want you to name your sound game inspired by your side, explain it, then, let's play it. Debaters, does this make sense?
NICK CANALES: I believe it does.
PETER MCNERNEY: Yes.
MOLLY BLOOM: OK, we're going to start with Nick.
NICK CANALES: I would like to play a brand new version of tag called T tag. The way that it works is one person is IT, and they're trying to listen for the tah. Everybody else says, T. Whenever you say T, you can't be caught. But as soon as somebody says tah, the person who's IT has to say tah before they can say T again, and then that person becomes IT.
MOLLY BLOOM: Ooh.
NICK CANALES: All right. So, great. I'll be IT to start. So everyone else can only say T. As soon as I hear somebody say tah, I can tag them if I say tah before somebody else says T again.
MOLLY BLOOM: Whoa, OK. Do we take turns saying T?
NICK CANALES: Yeah, you can all say T as many times as you want, but if I hear a tah and I say tah, that person who tah'ed is IT.
MOLLY BLOOM: OK.
TRUMAN: OK.
MOLLY BLOOM: I'm ready.
TRUMAN: I'm partially ready, yes.
MOLLY BLOOM: On your marks, get set, go!
PETER MCNERNEY: I sort of get it.
MOLLY BLOOM: T.
TRUMAN: T.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tah.
NICK CANALES: Tah!
MOLLY BLOOM: T.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tah.
NICK CANALES: Tah, tah. No, no, I tah'ed the tah.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tah.
MOLLY BLOOM: T
NICK CANALES: I tah'ed the tah. I tah'ed--
TRUMAN: T.
NICK CANALES: No, no. I tah'ed the tah--
TRUMAN: T.
NICK CANALES: --and I'm pretty sure it was Peter's voice.
PETER MCNERNEY: You didn't tah the tah the tah.
MOLLY BLOOM: T. [LAUGHS]
NICK CANALES: I tah'ed Peter's tah.
PETER MCNERNEY: I tah'ed the tah the tah the tah.
NICK CANALES: Stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop.
TRUMAN: Tah, T.
NICK CANALES: New round, new round.
PETER MCNERNEY: I can't stop saying tah!
NICK CANALES: New round!
[LAUGHS]
Peter's-- Peter's the new tah'er. Peters IT. I tah'ed his tah.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tah.
NICK CANALES: I tah'ed your tah, Peter.
PETER MCNERNEY: Tah.
TRUMAN: T.
NICK CANALES: You tah'ed early and I tah'ed it. All right.
MOLLY BLOOM: OK, you tah'ed it.
PETER MCNERNEY: Who's tah'ed?
NICK CANALES: Tah'ed is IT. IT is tah'ed. Tah'ed is IT.
TRUMAN: So, T, tahdy.
PETER MCNERNEY: Yeah, and you tah'ed it well.
NICK CANALES: I'm glad that I tah'ed you well. Good.
MOLLY BLOOM: That was very good.
NICK CANALES: I'm glad I tah'ed it well. Thank you.
[LAUGHS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Excellent work. That was fun. I want to play that again. All right, Peter, it is your turn. Let's hear about your new audio only version of hide and seek.
PETER MCNERNEY: My audio only version of hide and seek is very simple. We all close our eyes and in your mind, if you're the hider, you decide where you want to hide. And then you say guess where I'm hiding, but in a voice that makes it sound like you're in that space.
[LAUGHS]
And then, you have to guess what kind of space I'm in. For example, I'm going to pick in my mind a suitcase. And then, we go, all right, ready. We go, [MUFFLED SHOUTING] I'm hiding! Come find me!
[LAUGHS]
And then you say, are you in a box? [MUFFLED SHOUTING] Nope, I'm not in a box.
NICK CANALES: All right, great. I'm ready, I'm ready.
MOLLY BLOOM: OK. Yeah, you guys should play this.
NICK CANALES: All right, ready?
PETER MCNERNEY: All right.
MOLLY BLOOM: Yeah.
NICK CANALES: All right, are you ready? [TURKEY GOBBLING SOUNDS]
PETER MCNERNEY: Are you hiding or--
NICK CANALES: Guess where I'm hiding? [TURKEY GOBBLING SOUNDS]
[LAUGHS]
PETER MCNERNEY: In a turkey?
[LAUGHS]
NICK CANALES: No, I was underwater.
TRUMAN: Underwater?
NICK CANALES: Underwater, underwater. Yes, yes, Truman is correct.
TRUMAN: I was right, I was right.
NICK CANALES: Points for Truman. Truman's-- Truman's the seeker.
TRUMAN: Huzzah.
MOLLY BLOOM: Truman found you.
PETER MCNERNEY: [MUFFLED SHOUTING] I am trapped in a suitcase and I can't get out.
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS]
NICK CANALES: Are you in a suitcase and you can't get out?
PETER MCNERNEY: That's not really easy to do.
[LAUGHS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Oh my gosh, these are both so fun. So we've got two excellent games here. We've got T, tah tag--
TRUMAN: [LAUGHS] T, tah.
MOLLY BLOOM: --and the audio version of hide and seek. We've got guess where I'm hiding. It is very tough.
TRUMAN: It's very tough.
PETER MCNERNEY: I'm going to call the game, can you hear where I'm hiding?
MOLLY BLOOM: Ooh, love it. OK, so we've got T, tah tag and can you hear where I'm hiding? I need you, Truman, to award a point to your favorite game.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
TRUMAN: I'm awarding.
[BELL DINGS]
MOLLY BLOOM: It is time for our final round, The Final Six. In this round, each team will have just six words to sum up the glory of their side. Peter, let's hear your six words for the heart pounding hide and seek.
PETER MCNERNEY: Ready or not, here comes fun!
[LAUGHS]
TRUMAN: I applaud you.
MOLLY BLOOM: Oh, excellent, excellent. OK, Nick, it's your turn. Give us six words that will help you brag about tag.
NICK CANALES: Why hide? Have more fun. Run!
[LAUGHS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Oh, man. Two really good Final Sixes there. But Truman, only one of them can receive your final point.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
Have you made your decision?
TRUMAN: Yes.
[BELL DINGS]
MOLLY BLOOM: Are you ready to crown one team the Smash Boom Best?
TRUMAN: I am.
MOLLY BLOOM: All right. Drumroll, please. And the winner is--
TRUMAN: It is hide and seek.
PETER MCNERNEY: Yay!
NICK CANALES: Fair. Fair. Fair enough.
PETER MCNERNEY: I'll take it!
TRUMAN: It was very close.
PETER MCNERNEY: I'll take it.
NICK CANALES: Congrats.
TRUMAN: It came down to the Final Six. And ready or not, here I come is such a classic. But adding the fun, it was just-- it was--
PETER MCNERNEY: Here comes fun.
TRUMAN: --perfect. I loved it and I forgot that that was six words, so I thought it was really clever.
MOLLY BLOOM: Nicely done, both of you.
PETER MCNERNEY: What I enjoyed about Nick's performance was, besides every single second of it, thinking about it later, I also loved that. Nick, you did make me want to run around and for that, thank you. And your presence makes everything better.
MOLLY BLOOM: Aww.
TRUMAN: Aww.
NICK CANALES: Thanks, Peter. I feel like I won, even though I lost. Wow. I'm blown away by Peter's creativity. Just hearing him do all the different voices was so fun. I think that game, guess where I'm hiding now, is brilliant. I think we're going to hopefully play it constantly on road trips.
PETER MCNERNEY: Oh, we're going to play it.
NICK CANALES: I just want to keep. I just want to keep playing that game. I could play that all day. It sounds so fun. I found Peter's performance of it very impressive. So I get it, I get it. I think he deserves the win.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
MOLLY BLOOM: Well, that's it for today's debate battle. Truman crowned hide and seek the Smash Boom Best, but what about you?
TRUMAN: Head to smashboom.org and vote to tell us who you think won.
MOLLY BLOOM: Smash Boom Best is brought to you by Brains On! and APM Studios. It's produced by Molly Bloom--
ANNA WEGGEL: Anna Weggel.
MOLLY BLOOM: And--
ARON WOLDESLASSIE: Aron Woldeslassie.
MOLLY BLOOM: We had engineering help from Alex Simpson and Gary O'Keefe with sound design by--
ANNA WEGGEL: Anna Weggel.
MOLLY BLOOM: Our editors are--
SHAHLA FARZAN: Shahla Farzan.
MOLLY BLOOM: And--
SANDEN TOTTEN: Sanden Totten.
MOLLY BLOOM: With fact checking by--
REBECCA RAND: Rebecca Rand.
MOLLY BLOOM: And we had production help from the rest of the Brains On! Universe team--
ROSIE DUPONT: Rosie DuPont.
RACHEL BREES: Rachel Brees.
ANNA GOLDFIELD: Anna Goldfield.
NICO GONZALEZ WISLER: Nico Gonzalez Wisler.
RUBY GUTHRIE: Ruby Guthrie.
LAUREN HUMBERT: Lauren Humbert.
JOSHUA RAY: Joshua Ray.
MARC SANCHEZ: Marc Sanchez.
MOLLY BLOOM: And--
CHARLOTTE TRAVER: Charlotte Traver.
MOLLY BLOOM: Our executive producer is Beth Perlman, and the APM Studios executives in charge are Chandra Kavati and Joanne Griffith. Our announcer is Marley Feuerwerker-Otto, and we want to give a special thanks to Austin Cross and Taylor Kaufman. Nick, is there anyone you'd like to give a shout out to today?
NICK CANALES: I'd like to give a shout out to my kids, RJ and Nico, and to the kids at PS 145 and 154.
MOLLY BLOOM: Woo hoo. And how about you, Peter? Any special shout outs?
PETER MCNERNEY: My kids, Brennan, Maybin, and their school, PS 11, across the street. Now you know where I live.
MOLLY BLOOM: [LAUGHS] Oh, we love the Story Pirates. Truman, do you want to give any special thanks?
TRUMAN: I want to give a special thanks to my mom, my dad, and everybody who's helped me throughout my life.
MOLLY BLOOM: That is a beautiful thing.
TRUMAN: Smash Boom Best is a nonprofit public radio program.
MOLLY BLOOM: If you're between the ages of 13 and 18 and you'd like to be a judge, or if you're any age and you have an idea for a Knock Down Drag Out debate, head to smashboom.org/contact and drop us a line. And while you're at it, join Smarty Pass for bonus episodes and ad free versions of all four shows in the Brains On! Universe. We'll be back with a new Smash Boom Best debate battle next week. Frankenstein's monster versus Frosty the Snowman! Goodbye!
TRUMAN: See you later, alligator.
NICK CANALES: You're it!
PETER MCNERNEY: You're it! You're it! Gotcha! I was going to say the same thing.
NICK CANALES: Peter, that's hilarious.
[LAUGHS]
[MUSIC PLAYING]
(SINGING) Ooh, you're the Smash Boom Best
Ooh, put you through the test
Ooh, you're the Smash Boom Best
Ooh, better than the rest
It's the Smash Boom Best
It's the Smash Boom Best
NICK CANALES: Can you hear where I'm hiding?
MOLLY BLOOM: Yeah, go ahead.
NICK CANALES: [WOBBLY VOICE] Your problem is you're never going to find me. You're never going to find me.
[LAUGHS]
PETER MCNERNEY: Are you hiding inside the dream of an alien?
NICK CANALES: [WOBBLY VOICE] Close, no.
TRUMAN: Are you a free elf, Dobby?
NICK CANALES: [WOBBLY VOICE] Not quite.
MOLLY BLOOM: Are you inside a fan?
NICK CANALES: Yes, I was in a fan. Yeah, how'd you know that was it?
[LAUGHS]
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